Ep. 101 - How to stay together when you're stuck together with Eve Rodsky
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I’m so excited for you to hear this week’s episode. We have a returning guest, Eve Rodsky, whose last interview is one of the top three most listened to Motherkind episodes!
Eve is working to change society ‘one marriage at a time’, and is the author of the incredible book ‘Fair Play: Share the mental load, rebalance your relationship and transform your life’. If you haven’t listened to her previous episode, I highly recommend you give it a listen (click here to tune in).
Our current situation has really highlighted exactly what us mothers have to do – the mental load and all the invisible labour to take care of our children and keep our households running.
Eve invites us to treat this moment – this ‘pause’ of real life – as an opportunity to model fairness and equality for our children and our communities.
In this episode, we talk about communication - and Eve shares some fantastic ideas for how to communicate with our partners about managing the household fairly. We also explore the ‘dirty dozen’ – the twelve tasks that are causing the most stress at home right now. Eve also talks a bit about home-schooling, which I know is a real pinch point for many of you right now.
I really loved our conversation and I hope you enjoy listening to the episode. As always, we continue the conversation over on Instagram so do hop over and let us know what you thought.
You can download a transcript of this week’s episode here.
Key takeaways from this week’s episode:
The Invisible Becoming Visible:
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The cultural movement of valuing the invisible work of women is now moving forward. (05:28)
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During this time, we're thrown in a cycle of confusion versus happiness versus urgency. (05:56)
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Men are now seeing the stress in their partners because of the lockdown situation. (06:08)
New Fair Play Data:
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During the lockdown, Eve was able to go over social media to get survey responses and speak to couples in Zoom. (06:48)
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The Wildcards: The term that Eve uses in Fair Play for someone who's had significant job loss. (07:23)
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Fair Play is a metaphor. It’s a self-help book based on a card game meditation tool you can play with your partner. There are 100 cards in the Fair Play system representing all it takes to run a home and raise a family. (08:07)
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Eve asked couples what cards are causing the most stress in their home at this time. (08:33)
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The ‘dirty dozen’ or the 12 most stressful domestic tasks are (1) laundry, (2) groceries, (3) meals, (4) home supplies, (5) tidying up, (6) cleaning dishes, (7) garbage, (8) discipline, (9) screentime, (10) homework, (11) watching the kids, (12) social interactions. (08:45)
The Collapse of Boundaries:
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There used to be boundaries around our lives, where kids go to school and parents go to work. (10:23)
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The current situation takes away the boundaries that parents have, with school being one of the primary boundaries. This structure is causing a lot of problems. (11:26)
Setting Boundaries:
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Because domestic work defaults to women, it’s up to them to set boundaries. (13:13)
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The best way to set boundaries is to enter a system. A system consists of practices allowing you to have clearly defined expectations. (13:34)
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To create a system during this pandemic, women have to communicate with their partners. (14:22)
Rule #1 of Intentional Communication:
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The first rule is to understand that we're already communicating. (17:12)
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People are more willing to communicate more intentionally when they know they are already communicating. (17:27)
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Try Eve’s communication vulnerability quiz by listening to the full episode! (17:35)
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Knowing your communication vulnerability can be constructive. (21:05)
Rule #2 of Intentional Communication:
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The second rule is recognising your vulnerability and then doing something about it. (21:19)
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Listen to the full episode where I share a recent example of my communication vulnerability! (21:35)
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Avoid feedback when emotions are high and cognition is low. (22:09)
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Spend 10 minutes at night with your partner to check in with each other. (23:42)
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Use the nightly check-in to divide homeschool work with your partner. (24:17)
Rule #3 of Intentional Communication:
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This rule tackles what you will talk about and why you are there for the check-in. (26:05)
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Eve gives examples of her why’s. (26:15)
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Knowing your ‘why’ before the nightly check-in can be powerful because then you’re able to communicate it. (27:19)
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‘I’ statements are not really helpful for communicating with your partner. (28:25)
Finding Time for Communication:
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Using the three rules of intentional communication together means understanding that it’s not scary to come to the table. (29:31)
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Use your commute time to communicate. (30:31)
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Investing time to communicate is vital because it defines roles and expectations, which, in turn, contributes to efficiency. (31:39)
Homeschooling and Overcoming Guilt and Shame:
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Eve shares an exercise for guilt and shame that she did before her book tour. (32:49)
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We don’t need guilt and shame. Whatever you’re doing for your child right now is amazing. (33:31)
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Success is about executive function and the soft skills of emotional communication. (33:51)
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Eve explains how she uses Fair Play cards with her kids and the importance of learning how to do a task from start to finish. (34:09)
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I share how my husband and I had the conversation of how we will handle Jessie’s schooling during the lockdown. Valuing emotional development over academics played a role in our decision. (36:58)
Everyone Has Different Priorities:
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Everyone has different values and priorities. It is up to each of us to communicate and check in with each other to figure out how to make things work. (40:07)
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It is about aligning with your values. However, nothing is set in stone. (41:15)
The Unicorn Space and Avoiding Burnout:
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Unicorn space is simply the time and space you invest in exploring your interests or things that spike your curiosity. (42:59)
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It’s the most important thing you can do for yourself to avoid burnout because it allows you to be unavailable. (43:27)
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That unavailability is the key to our mental health. (44:08)
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Many women shared with Eve that divorce was their antidote for burnout. However, growing up in a single-parent household, Eve said she doesn’t want to reach that point. (45:47)
Resources mentioned in this episode
● Motherkind Podcast Episode 75: Eve Rodsky - The New Game-Changing Solution for When You Have Too Much to Do
● Burnout: The Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle by Emily Nagoski, PhD
● FREEBIES! Find out how you can take control of your life, reconnect to you, and more! Download ‘10 Ways to Reconnect to You’ and our weekly and monthly check-in on Motherkind.co.
● Are you ready to find freedom from guilt? Let me help you find Freedom from Perfectionism if you are a mother who has ever felt not quite enough.
About Eve
Eve Rodsky is a New York Times bestselling author and a Harvard-trained lawyer. She is the founder of the Philanthropy Advisory Group. There, she provides advice to high net worth families and charitable foundations on the best practices, operations, and disposition of funds. Her expertise lies in mediation, strategising, and organisational management with families. Now, Eve aims to change the system for couples aiming for peace, balance and efficiency in their lives.